Bitcoin Q&A | Britcoiners by CoinCorner #71

Join Danny, Molly, Zakk, and Dave for this weeks ramblings. Topics this week include: A Bitcoin Q&A, Peter Zeihan on Joe Rogan, proof of the cost of living crisis, less than 100 Bitcoin ATMs added in the second half of 2022, MtGox repayment deadline moved to March 2023, Huobi confirm 20% layoff, 91% of cryptos from 2014 have died, Bank of France governor calls for mandatory licensing, and Thai SEC launch crypto academy to help investors. Our Merchant of the Month is Red Ruby Kate. For all your steak and beef needs head over to A video version of this episode is also available on our YouTube channel: This episode is sponsored by: CoinCorner ( - A global leader in Bitcoin and Lightning services.

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welcome back to another episode of brick Corners where's the clap great intro yeah you're gonna apologize for the drilling as well a little bit no like I'll let you handle that sorry about the drawing day 150. driving me mad 150 is it actually 150 are you making that number up no it's about 150. it's not been 30 since you last we last talked about on yeah possibly could be it's back in December yeah I reckon it'd be about 150 now 12 days in though was meant to be the timeline anyway less of that Bitcoin it's a Bitcoin podcast Danny it is a Bitcoin podcast Danny's just told us all off before the podcast yeah it did strike Dave it's not what you were saying a minute ago you [Laughter] please talk about Bitcoin although I'm looking forward to your topics that you've got Bitcoins on a tangent after seven years my household is out of nappies no one's no one requires a nappy change anymore right we've just been sorry so every like no more kids in Naples I was changing you're gonna be next in line well that's what I told I told my wife like the next Snapper you might change is probably mine so it's been seven years about four nappies a day dog night and nappies nope all over nice period in my life happy New Year freed up a lot of time wow yeah and a lot of money yeah anyway this is a Bitcoin sorry yes Bitcoin so what topics have we got this week not nappies um all right bit of a bit of a bearish week on the news front so feel free to just be like no too depressing okay uh less than 108 Bitcoin ATMs added worldwide in the second half of 2022. we'll touch on that okay Bank box repayment registration deadline is moved to March 2023 okay uh I don't know how to pronounce that Swift death s w y f t x I don't know what that is Swift X to chop its own program this week citing Mercury regulations I don't know who they are I don't know but kind of like to be expected after all the drama oh another one I can't pronounce I mean why would you read it before this time her will be hereby confirms 20 layoffs denies insolvency rumors that's annoying because last week you were like you were claiming well not claiming saying the finance were bankrupt although not to quote you on that so this is another one that you can't put words on my mind they've denied insolvent insolventory Danny you were saying that but I won't quote you on that I don't remember saying that I don't remember you saying it I don't remember saying it it's publicly I mean it's real yeah I think I put it that was going to be the headline for us did I put a disclaimer though saying that yeah that if they were bankrupt not they are you said disclaimer I'm not 100 sure or something like that yeah but you can just click that better yeah um the Bitcoin symbol has been added to list of currencies supported by Microsoft Excel that's exciting for you David yeah I reckon at least two years oh more than that well it might have been a pin tweet it was at the top of it all over that for years I was happy when I saw that though wait yeah cool uh 90 or 91 of cryptos from 2014 have died while Bitcoin continues to thrive that's very bullish yeah uh Bank of France Governor calls for mandatory licensing for crypto companies and the Thai SEC launches crypto Academy to help digital asset investors nice cool cool that's the news for the weekend then you know we've got other stuff a list of questions q a section for you too oh the great q a yeah should we just go straight into the Q a yeah sure sure price will 17 258. finally broke 17 barriers waiting for that for about a week bouncing off it when did we go there last night yeah beautiful yeah I think everything's going up there isn't I think confusion as to why yeah but um is what it is the whole Market is very bullish in terms of the price in the last few days isn't it everything's popped up uh in the crypto sector yeah I think the main Market why is that is that just me as investors I think that's why everyone's confused why is it going up um it's probably there's a lack of depth I guess um in most places so larger buys will make bigger impacts than they did six months ago and twelve months ago yeah um so I think it's probably just a this feels very much like 20 19 I'd say 19 20 sort of times and it was just a slow down sorry I don't know why I was just like you know when like it all feels like 20 20. it feels like yeah it's like yeah I can't really remember yeah I was trying to think what it feels like it was the slow grind up yeah 2015 16. so if that's where we were about like just when we were three three or four so twenty end of 2018 started 2019 it dipped down to that sort of region the bottom as such but then it was just a slow grind up from that point to 2020 was that then it crept its way back up to about 12 000. yeah and then we had the covid crash which dipped back down to about did it good they didn't get four or five-ish did it get that low it was just in a one day and went straight back up yeah it dipped and then but then it was again a slow grind back up again but it went from yeah 3K to 12K over about a 15 month period just seems like a lifetime ago doesn't it it's very boring but that's I think that's what it feels like at the minute we're back because they're so grind back up yeah it's a slow grade it's always up but it's just yeah climbing yeah which this year we started off very bullish in terms of green and green days just a very slow one it just frustrates me because nobody outside this office wants to talk to bitcoin talk talk about Bitcoin with me I literally just want anybody to ask but because because like normies only care about the price when the price isn't doing anything nobody asks me about my job or about my about work I'm just like come on I want to tell you about all the developments that happen but they don't care yeah it makes me frustrated so I just come in like a really bad take on Joe Rogan by someone not sure if everyone's heard that yeah I haven't heard it I can't remember it's the same old thing Bitcoin hasn't got any intrinsic value and I'm just like oh my God I will like we are literally just sending allowing people to remit to Nigeria for a fraction of a penny and people are saying telling me that's got no intrinsic value I just want to go you know Shake people say how's that not about intrinsic value they don't know enough of these people I think he's part of it they're just closing their eyes so what is actually happening around the world with Bitcoin and the development so I think the it was that and there was one on pomp as well I think pump's response was I think pretty good I think he'd be well armed for a good response yeah it was Dreadful I thought but I thought Joe Rogan might be more like equipped to deal with it like in terms of account or argument to say like the no intrinsic value thing is just ridiculous I mean what what does that even mean this is back to the 2015 and then the 2019 same conversation oh yeah but that's what I'm saying that's why I brought it up but it's like how has that been dragged up in a few months time we'll get the same energy argument that's not been picked up for a while and cycle the arguments but this the arguments end up coming from it's a different range of people each time but every time the site the coming them questions are coming back around it's coming from a new set of people that don't have a clue and don't have good experience in the industry or knowledge of the industry it feels like you could go through your old tweets and just say right when I answered this the first time around yeah this is the answer yeah and you know and it's still the answer yeah unfortunately but that is education Yeah the more people keep coming in every cycle you have to keep doing the same bits of Education over and over again because again I've forgotten his name but it's been clipped everywhere I've seen a lot so it's like oh it's you know the price is at 17 or whatever only so oh it's still got 17 to 12 then and I was like because he's focused on the fact that it was at nearly 70. it's the same same spiritual functionality or something yeah all over again so yeah I saw that anyway welcome yeah but you know I'm four years and I'm getting fed up with the arguments you're even longer so I just don't answer I'm so angry all the time you know that so I'm angry for now I'll just get wound up I just cut back unanswering people and say if you don't understand it fine crack on yeah but that I don't think that's helpful I think you just need to because FAQ should just be ready no because a lot of them you can do you can have like yeah um boiler Point answers boilerplate answers to push out some but I think a lot of them people don't want to know and don't want to learn and they're putting it out there for controversial comments to get attention for themselves because you've got to think there's new people to the market every day so maybe that's why we have it here when people join it's just like oh wow they don't even know about yeah someone's asking me about Michael Sayler I was like what a wishbook you educate people that want to know but I think the people like the one podcast and did things that are basically going on there to bad mouth it get attention for themselves get a bit of a name for themselves it's all about their Devon agenda and a reason to go on and they don't want to be taught and educated on the topic because they can get more attention the guy who I don't know his name has said something inflammatory in a a very busy busy ecosphere so like he's going to get a lot of attention isn't he because of what he said yeah so actually it's the same old what is his intentions and incentive might be to get lots of content clicks and some words I might just genuinely believe his statements because he doesn't have the education it doesn't have to always want attention he might just genuinely believe that but a lot of these people never want to be educated they never want to talk to you and actually if you're coming from a standpoint of not knowing of the full facts it's like I don't know about enough about the copper industry or like any sort of let me tell you that you're like coffee or so if I don't drink or if I don't like green tea see I wouldn't then say of green tea he's got no intrinsic value people people don't people's egos are too big to say that I don't under I don't know enough about that and yours is too big um you've got to be happy you've never heard on a podcast the guest goes oh I don't know they always come up with something about it there's neat stuff we do it all the time yeah there's answers on it yeah yeah but well I mean we had an episode that was like basically all the questions none of the answers yeah yeah but people need to be happy you're doing that because literally you've got to be happy being the stupid person in the room never asking that stupid question yeah that's from Simon says stupid question yeah there's something I don't understand I'll just be like what is that and people go you should know that you're an idiot yeah it's a calculator anyway um what were you talking about so should we get on to the first topic session yeah I've kind of random preps no because everyone's going to answer I'm not just me answering come on I don't want to hear my voice also oh what so are you going to read the questions out but you don't want anyone to hear your voice all the time so it's been demoted though yeah I can't get lower than Tigo you can't get low when you've got a contract true and no one's made a drink today sorry yeah people do that often as well yeah quick they're in a meeting girl meal anyway so that's cranky isn't it yeah I'm just feeling ill today so I'm just ill tired and he's cranky yeah let's do a podcast right how do so one of the first questions how do we increase Bitcoin usage while building your nestec um so someone's saying they seem to be mixed messages for stacking SATs basically but also spending stats when you spend them replacing yep also attack when when push live the stack can replace the spend and replace oh yeah well um sorry what was the question how do we encourage adoption but also build a nestec had increased spending Bitcoin but at the same time people without spending oh well no I think the way is like what we're doing now like with the send globally one actually it pulls from your pound or your Euro balance buys Bitcoin effectively and sends up somewhere so you could be paying for something so like I think quite a few accounts all in trial I mean like mine's yeah I wanted to do that I think yours is so yeah even when we're paying a normal lightning invoice it's pulling from our pound and our euros and sending the Bitcoin so that is probably the them sort of products that are slowly coming to Market a bit more like the strike equivalent uh are kicking in and that'll help a lot a lot from using Bitcoin and still being able to stack but from a maxi point of view I I personally have been able to convert a lot more Fiat say at the start of the month because I can spend it yeah so whereas I would leave more for you to buy my lunch now I can buy my lunch with a bold card I would then obviously convert more to bitcoin so basically it's just that's general adoption isn't it you just get more Bitcoin oh yeah the complete the opposite end is try and get paid fully in Bitcoin and then you're only converting when you need to Fiat yeah I think we still have such a big problem with people with the investment mindset though because I was having this conversation literally yesterday um someone I know is just used one of our Merchants that accept Bitcoin and I said oh why aren't you paying Bitcoin and they don't want to because they're gonna have to buy the Bitcoin and then why would they go into bet and it's also like the the step in between of having to I already have Bitcoin though they do so won't they spend the Bitcoin they've got because they don't want to spend the Bitcoin yeah they want to huddle so it's a case of like wanting to wanting to do it or not wanting to do it but there's that extra step of buying it in at that point you might as well just playing Fiat yeah so if people want to support the ecosystem they kind of almost got yeah I love people and there's a bit of a problem within the industry though I think because we've all been to the conferences and the actual percentage of people buying stuff with Bitcoin is very low and that's supposed to be you know the plebs on the ground I think a lot of them never use lightning in the real world scenario and that's a reality or not people it's like that often all that sort of stuff um but that is a reality at the minute that we need to deal with and we are trying to deal with and figure out but I think the in my head obviously one is yeah using these new products where you can just scan a QR code make the payment it pulls from your pound your Fiat balance and then pay using Bitcoin but also finding um real-world use cases for Bitcoin not just get the local cafe down the street except to bitcoin and everyone will go and spend there because the reality is they don't but actually on your everyday life where do you spend money and they're the places that you need to on board with Bitcoin and I appreciate a lot of them end up being like you know your Tesco your Asda your places that are your weekly shopping and things where people will spend money and the reality of us getting them on to accept Bitcoin anytime soon is slim but the can you on board certain places that you might spend on a monthly basis somewhere and you regularly go there you want them ones on board so you can go and spend and make that um do you think we need to engage slightly better with our customers in terms of because I think we might be in a bit of a bubble because we use lightning daily in all the time and a couple of many of our customers won't be doing that at the moment no because they can't there's no way to spend it that's exactly it is it a reach could could we reach out and say well how could we help further is it a specific Merchant in your area that might help that we could Target or you could help us Target here maybe we could take action points like that to help there needs to be ones that you regularly go to not just one that you think but we're not gonna know it's not even Merchant adoption though I saved 50 of my lightning usage is sending it to you guys send it to other people yeah kind of peer-to-peer Style so just trying to encourage that you know you're a bar someone's buying the round paying back yeah yeah I mean it's so much yeah I think yeah it's so much cooler like I get a little dopamine here every time I go extend like the paper lighting whether it's like yeah the real Hope In Like A decade is That's So normal you don't get that dopamine hey it's just normal payments I want to show up one day and see someone use Bitcoin and not film it yeah that happens a lot too we need to normalize it where it's just like it's a payment method I know we do it for content and it's good but like eventually it's just be normal I see someone making the payment someone filming them yeah yeah and that's every Bitcoin yeah it needs to be normalized it just takes time yeah it takes time but how's Molly going to get her dopamine here if you if that just becomes normalized it's so true like when I go like you know to places over here that accept Bitcoin they even just want to see the little sign I'm like um yeah no that means it's not normalized but it just takes time I think doesn't it so it's a lot normal now than it was five years ago yeah very much like Dave and I get today's level of not giving a [ __ ] then yeah yeah math adoption we're there yeah cool next question is a bit of a weird one um it's a very nice little person I think it's I was so weird because it's a tech one Zach but I think there's not really much question um so they're saying uh Curious to unpack the payment routing and opening of chat closing channels in practice um in use cases so saying like a new B2B business comes on board um to issue lightning invoices I think there's just a lack of understanding in some of that where if a new business comes on board with coin Corner they don't need to open up lightning channels no we're inherently custodial so you're using our lightning services are people under the impression that if you have likely notes at a business that you need channels at every supplier I think which one yeah which if you're running like BTC pay you do but that I would expect a level of knowledge if you're running that kind of setup yeah at which point then you would know the answer to yeah um and as yeah the next one was very summer as well I knew Kathy coming on board to accept lightning payments from all customers so yeah of course it just needs same question really um they don't need to do anything if they're using coin Corner if they're not using coin corn corner and they're using like BT pay server then this question's probably mute because they should know what they're doing yeah and there is a steep learning curve if they are doing that maybe not experienced with it but there's a bunch of UI tools now where it makes it easier um to to open those channels but it's still very much at the advanced stage of things do you think yes yeah I think we're just in this bubble where I was so used to it but even just to explain what channels are to a cafe owner that is kind of interested in Bitcoin it's like you don't know almost impossible probably I suppose if you're starting from absolute zero then there is a fair bit for a few barriers isn't there even but there have been steps in the right direction like umbrella has made opening your own yeah yeah it's still that's still complicated it's made it easier for the people that want to do it yeah most of them are people that already understand Bitcoin and already understand the industry okay a little bit about lightning putting that to the man on the street getting him set up the node and then to actually make use of that node is they're two different things yeah they it is very complex is this another one that time will cure it in terms of time will become ux progressions yeah I think so right um but a lot of it will be the easy ux will still be the custodial one um short to midterm anyway and maybe long term it'll get easier yeah for non-custodial but that just again it's time all part of the adoption yeah and everyone hates custodial stuff yeah there's a lot of stick in terms of big ones yeah Bitcoin is custodial but I don't think the Shop's coming on board yes no they don't care and that's the reality the reality of it as well is custodial will always yeah it's a trade-off for it but custodial will always um be that drive without the custodial companies out there at the minute Bitcoin wouldn't wear us today and there's nothing and even custodial lighting you look at the biggest lightning wallet what would you say that is I'd say while it's Satoshi probably yeah yeah it was it's entirely custodial yeah I thought it might be cracking now no they don't have a wallet really no it's an actual app well you see all the videos and stuff what are they always using well this Tosh is a big one because there's no sign up but it is but that will change as well but they're getting forced to be that'll be K light seeds too right um so yeah let's be cautious of but yeah there's they are all because there's very few that are non-custodial Phoenix is probably As Good As It Gets non-custodial um people talk about moon but moons on chain slash lightning it's a weird way they've done it but that doesn't scale either uh the way that's set but the minute will not yeah which they know I think they're making the V2 right or Phoenix ESC group I think okay okay that's good we'll have to move quickly with these because these are going to take a long time oh there's loads you keep dragging them out Dave just answering them thoroughly there you are nothing you just go yeah yeah stupid question infinite game so this is touching on the infinite game um about survival rather than winning uh is fear already unsustainable um many others see the death as a fear as inevitable um but they never hear us say something is inevitable do we think fear Will Survive uh similarly for Bitcoin personal view is that long as long as it survives it will Thrive it doesn't need to improve how much would you agree or disagree they sound like English I don't think I'll be alive by the time fails but I think it will as a whole that will I'll be dead so it doesn't work so be a government-issued currency right so because like all currencies have a lifespan we do yeah the average lifespan of a question is yeah coincidentally is it I think Southwest 28. really good sound bite a really good shot edit Molly out of that bit but that would be really good get ready for the short if we can do this one but before I think individual fears the lifespan's short but fear as it feels the concepts oh 35 oh we're both well okay yeah um so you think they'll always be within your lifetime yeah I think so yeah the government issued in some form of fear whether that might become cbdc yeah I agree yeah yeah I don't think the well I think when people say that people use words too much I think for a lot that sounds really weird people are always using bloody words but people are using words same I'm on your side mates sick of words words let's just do looks stop using those words see what we need is that yeah um I think the words people use these like you know the downfall of fear is inevitable great what does that mean the reality of what that means and what the person's saying unless they go into the detail and explain it all half the time I don't think they understand what that means and well inherently that means downfall of government in some form yeah but are we talking global scale exactly yeah and the Western world are we talking yeah um are we talking like every single fiat currency collapsing around the whole world and like you say what impact does that have then on the governments and how they're running everything else it's just a sweeping statement with words that don't necessarily and people eat that up sometimes because it's like this bullish sentiment towards Bitcoin because fear is inevitably gonna die but well I don't believe you guys are probably are they becoming more centralized I presume there are less fear individual Fiat currencies than there were like the euroers I don't know like marginalizing some you might get more using the digital Yen when that comes out in terms of their cbdc if they become the biggest trade so you might get like well yeah it becomes one Global well the kind of dollars can't dominate that way for the last 50 years obviously a lot of people yeah a lot of countries are using that instead of their own aren't they and then some of them now like El Salvador have gone to bitcoin instead of dollar but it doesn't mean to say as well as though isn't it uh yeah yeah but they're trying to come away from dollars I just think the concept if you're seeing more countries like adopting dollar or Chinese yen or Euro you might say you end up with like three powerful currencies and then you can have the rise of Bitcoin alongside that as a but all the individual because by not having your own government from a government perspective not having your own currency starts to remove power and control away from your country which is what has happened with people that use US dollar yeah um all that money that got dropped in over covid for the US economy was great for the U.S economy but terrible for everybody in the world that used all the stabilized checks the US residents got yeah yeah a great inflation levels that they're not used to and in these other countries like El Salvador um devalued them and they got nothing just like no benefit from that so I think they're out alone in that are they Venezuela I think they were pegged to the USD I think am I making out but there's a few it could be making yeah but there's a lot of them there's a lot but yeah okay so I think that takes away some of the their the control their power there um and Fiat for me I don't think it's inevitable that it'll die and I don't think within our lifetime I think as long as governments survive governments will try and keep a fiat currency in some capacity um I don't think it needs to die for Bitcoin to thrive you think they work alongside each other yeah which they're doing that right now we are literally doing that right now and Bitcoin is growing and growing and growing as time goes on um you know look that's like saying the US dollar will dominate the world and take over everybody um because that was the Global Currency yeah I think Bitcoin being alongside helps kind of not level it but like take back the power control a little bit of like the US can't just put sanctions on whoever they want there's an alternative to use Bitcoin in there um which can be used maybe in you know not so good ways but it's it's kind of like keeping everyone in check it's the checks and balances it's a global alternative yes at that point isn't it yeah there's no this this question is so vast I think that's why it frustrates me when I hear people say oh yeah the downfall of fear it's inevitable because that's a ridiculous comment and sweeping statement to make um because there's what's the detail and what's the definition of that behind everything talk us through what that means and how that plays out because the reality is nobody has a clue of what still and that's a sweeping statement in itself so I apologize but over a long enough time Horizon maybe it's true maybe over a long enough time Horizon being hundreds of years as we've seen play out in history I don't think it's in our lifetime and even depends how long you're planning to live for Danny but we've always had gold haven't we at the end of the Molly's drinking two liters of water a day now yeah I'm only having a cup of soups for work I am what flavor vegetable 37p a cup of soup cost a living crisis I'm trying to cut my food bill that's a nice segue into something else a living crisis right now you've got your stats yeah I would argue you could make in the fury because a large vat of soup one for the week and it'd be cheaper well that's I'm very glad you brought that up that'll be interesting because in the absolute anger I've stormed out of last week's podcast because Molly's said there's nothing to me because she couldn't identify the cost of living crisis so I went on the BBC today I was like okay the BBC is a litmus paper for the the social and economical situation in in the UK at the moment and the Articles featured on the BBC yeah include what's the best way to heat a room this winter right can batch cooking help cook cut shopping bills toy Library memberships rocket which is actually a good idea so you're not buying stuff every Christmas that's interesting Rising pets being abandoned due to the cost of living good showering could showering in the gym save you money yeah so that's just a selections not the toy thing but I've showered at the gym before to save money yeah but you know there's a huge problem if that's becoming a mainstream solution to things yeah if that's on the BBC but also brought my plants into work because it's warmer in the office than it is in my house and they're all dying but I know that's ridiculous I've brought them into work um people are looking at those electronic gelos because heating yourself is more efficient yourself is more efficient in one clip yeah but he's just went because he's outside he's not sat in his Lounge using it apparently they're really good the amount of people I know that have you seen these ooties like these fleecy ponchos I put one my whole family's got one right I was about to say everybody go along for Christmas yeah they're huge like a little massive cover of things really warm yeah you don't need to put your heating on exactly through the roof but that is the problem like that is the current economic situations are you just really upset about the cheese Dave I said well I'll just gobsmacked no I don't really spend a lot of money like I'm not your typical consumer except for plans and petrol but I don't really I'm I'm not in town some petrol yeah right honestly you look at my bank statement it's just plants people plants petrol plants Bitcoin plants petrol I don't I I don't buy that much stuff so I don't notice I also I bought this jumper yesterday and I was like oh this is a bit expensive but that's probably because of the cost of living process I also I'm not sure on the BBC like you took everything from the BBC I mean they've been on as you know I read daily mail I know for the headlines what are they saying well they've been doing but no no they've been doing them articles like that for the last two years about how to save money since covered I think with the exact same sort of articles but they're just like repeated regurgitated angles one of them was so bad I think on The Daily Mail everyone was making fun of that one then because it was it was ridiculous there was a guy it was a financial expert guy I can't remember it was now that was on I think it was the Daily Mail article and he was saying how to save money this coming up to this Christmas or whatever it was um the the reality of how much he saved over this doing all these things it was like only boiling your Kettle like once a day or something ridiculous like this and it ended up saving him like three pound twenty over a 12 month period And it's like okay but nice the reality of the reality of but the whole article was based on um was it imagine with inflation going up and you would never have been able to save anywhere near what he's the headline makes out the savings for these things are so minuscule it was just about things they changes you know obviously a little material and saving it's the point that that's what's being put out there as content at the moment because they know that that's what people need cooking has always been everyone like people have been batch cooking for years but we have to highlight it now no no this has been if you look back in the news this has been highlighted for like a couple of years at least that I'm aware of now since Kobe that was like the chaos there's loads of their Michael Daily Mail Dave go and check it out people this is more coming up again now because like the heating costs have like tripled so even though it was a small amount a year ago that came out at the start of the Ukraine Russia thing but this time last year was it yeah February last year when that first started coming out I think because they were saying about yeah the oil and the crisis I mean yeah it's like it's undeniable in terms of the numbers so yeah it's just that but is it not frustrate you that people need to like it frustrate to me that journalists need to write articles about something so obvious no because it's fresh in people's minds isn't it if they're just thinking like this needs views because of this month this is my job I mean living honest I've got to be popular articles they're ridiculous now the mindset is that right I've got to say money because there's a ridiculously clickbait and most of them don't really save you any money when you actually look at what they're telling you to do I think is also definitely I'm slightly concerned about your cup of tea there's absolutely no nutritional value to cup of soup you'll be dead before you like of any of the Articles put cup of soup in as one yeah [Laughter] honey I thought I'd point that out back to the Q a like it thank you uh right as a CEO I think you'll you have your right to have that long-term view but you ever worry that reality might move quicker than your plans questions so is your long-term view in terms of what Bitcoin adoption we just grow with the industry rather than Force the industry I think is is the general topic around this and is saying that if the industry grows too quickly and we're not prepared for it what do we do do we carry on well I think the point is no one's prepared because we've seen it yeah yeah 17 yes yeah just joins us yeah and I was the only Tech guy at the time yes the fullback we just didn't have anyone I think it was Carnage as a company we have to stay extremely Nimble because of the way this Market moves and we have to be prepared literally to drop everything and go down a different route and we have done that numerous occasions but I think we've built to to cope with that yeah it's probably a huge strength of us the fact that we don't have to maneuver too you know they have to go through all these processes like companies like hundreds of employees can't react as quickly yeah that's what we said actually we're in a better spot than this it's really it's like your command line isn't it it's like yeah ours is literally see it and other than the management team whereas you can get really convoluted structures that you know FTX or and there's in terms of they might have slowed down because of their company structures and their who was in charge and what there's ours is a lot more direct isn't it it's simple I think back in the 2017 is the best example like Zack's touched on there we're in 2017. but 2017 uh every pretty much every exchange out there was freezing sign ups because they couldn't handle the sign ups and they they were just yeah creating bad customer service we were fine probably until December in the December time and I think it was all technically Tech stacked no issues yeah because people were just coming through the door the issue became compliance kyc then processing them so that was our bottleneck at that point what people are going to say to that now well yeah and a bit of support because obviously the mentors would fall it was like taking weeks to get confirmation yeah manual things we had to deal with and handle but we could we handle them fine I think it was yeah this the response time for support and the compliance kyc getting people through the door with the two bottlenecks um but you know that didn't that was for a brief three or four week period in December 2017 um since then we've been prepared I guess or more prepared and we actually did quite well being a smaller company back then yeah in comparison to the big guys um so no I I think every bull market it comes quicker than we expect and we just deal with it so do you think it's also beneficial to have quite a strong Vision like because we've been Bitcoin only like focusing on bitcoin adoption Bitcoin um almost developing the Bitcoin space like with no distractions almost I think that's really helped and you've probably seen the fruits of it in the last 12 months in terms of what we've built how we've built it and and like the type of company we've become almost so we do like you haven't seen that from your binance there's a coinbases or I think coinbase you're out coinbase like they the nft platform is a good example for that we've not been distracted with nfts we've not bothered but they got distracted with nfts they started building the nft platform spent was it 240 million dollars people generally at coinbase would have gone nfts in the future I think yes because look from it because it's that level of leadership a company that where he would have gone or NF I'm really behind NFC yeah because none of them have spent the time to understand what yeah exactly the fact that oh this is a fad this is growing it was what they do on the kind of late to it yeah that's that was my point like right Bitcoin Bitcoin Bitcoin Bitcoin yeah and it's like wouldn't that because we're almost at the Forefront of development where we'd like to be we're very yeah yeah exactly so we won't be that late we won't be reactionary yep and that is yeah that was getting to that point yeah have I just cut yes yeah all right you're saving the waffle it's basically yeah turn on the Danny edit and I'll just chop me off cut them out and get straight to the point it was the NFC coinbase so yeah they took too long building that platform getting it out by the time they launched it nobody cared about nfts and they'd missed the boat that's because they were too slow yeah um but that's what these big companies do and they will try everything so they jumped on like altcoins icos they've jumped on blockchain they had a blockchain I don't know if you guys remember back back in the day but coinbase have jumped on every year hype so 2017. I'd say 2016 they had a blockchain Play Store yeah did a blockchain play store so it was like a place you can download the apps from with the blockchain apps did they have crypto kitties in there cool is that I can't remember remember that didn't last long but if that was like the blockchain hype cycle time and it was like oh blockchain can do all these things so they create a play store for it basically um and they do that every time something comes along they throw something as quick as they can to try and monetize it and make the most of that time um now they've got to a lot they could do that back in the day although I'm sure the blockchain Play Store didn't do very well they could do that when they were smaller now the bigger nft one is a perfect example of them not being able to react quick enough to the market but they also have to be seen to be doing something for their shareholders now they do as a public company to be doing being in this space because it's going to be massive how many times it's going to be massive it's all just hard yeah yeah and how many times they get that wrong will the shareholders start to lose confidence in what they're doing whereas I think if we just go right fundamentals Bitcoin we can't go wrong because the underlying it's about Bitcoin it's not about coincon at all if Bitcoin moves quick and Fiat dies then great because we're there in a position to do it probably one of the most um well-positioned companies in the world to be able to do that big claim I think it's very short not even just Bitcoin we put a lot of faith into lightning as well obviously so very the enlightening yeah I think we're confident enough in what we're doing with Bitcoin and lightning as a actual usage and use case that I think that's completely correct and I don't think anyone will dispute that we're one of the one of the not blow too much one of the best well-positioned filters Yeah well yeah you know that's what it is it's been all right yeah next question right uh controversial I was surprised the article didn't mention your own [ __ ] coin of phase oh okay why have you brought that one do you think do you think yeah no because I can explain this it's beautiful do you think you had a finite mindset back then or was that a mistake um Blah Blah's a couple of the points in there but I think generally blah blah blah blah blah blah blah uh my [ __ ] coin a phase was never really within calling corner I think is is part of mimas back in 2013 um 1314 which was before coin Corner even started now I'm trying to do every year the first wallet I downloaded 2000 10 I think it was actually kind of well yeah and then never do anything with it I've still got a wallet file it's nothing in it what an idiot um 2013-14 was but that was when you know Bitcoin was the one then it was like Litecoin and then Dogecoin came out and a lot of others but we were messing around with them and we were mining so it was playing around with all sorts making our own and just generally Tech messing around um once coin Corner started we launched with a couple of alts which was Dogecoin Litecoin by the time we launched I was pretty much already yeah the reason I think this question has been asked is more about having ethereum and Litecoin on our platform in a minute which actually came in 2017 18 times um but that wasn't because of us being [ __ ] coin as we were all full Bitcoin it was external investors that were potentially going to invest that wanted to see we could add these coins because that was what they wanted to see that was a guess the start of our journey of realizing a lot of these VCS and investors had no clue what they were talking about they were just following the headlines and the Hypes someone sort of just touched on my coinbase and we were having to appease them to even take an investment we eventually added them stupidly because we were trying to appease them and then we never actually took the investment from them anyway in the end so it kind of was a bit of a just shows you this it's almost a weakness isn't it like it's it's a if you're not that was a point where coincon was weak like kind of looking for investment as well yeah for about a year it's it's nice to have the directions strengthen so much at this point where we we look at that as like a a black mark to our name we're almost having yeah saying that whole thing helped us reaffirm like yeah whereas being Bitcoin only whenever that was was the weakness exactly but it's just people still bring it up it's just like oh God we're Bitcoin only pretty much from the we had a couple on at the start we took them off about nine months in I think was it and then um yeah I remember I joined and Doge was still on the platform just after that I think we removed I've been open about it um and then after that it wasn't until about 2018 when we added anything back in so it was Bitcoin only for three years I think it might have been um then I did these ones unfortunately they'd just sit there with exposure in the background but not no not doing anything with really but they've just it's more hassle to remove them oh they're an absolute nightmare yeah I think is the pain so yeah so that was my trick going to phase which wasn't really a face what are the longer term implications that you think it's like it's like and it gives you an STD and you're stuck with it for forever some of the memories you get rid of I wouldn't know um what are the longer term implications that you think people should be considering but maybe aren't yet um both on a personal level and a wider Bitcoin Network developer level a little personal level I'm intrigued by that one personal pleb level okay what does it say longer term implications of what type people are not thinking about I think so like maybe the developer one things like um people I guess what we're kind of seeing like with lightning maybe being more centralized in there's four implementations and the lightning Wars are coming there's there's potentially what the plebs have all been using lnd which is like in Labs has been dominant at like 90 of usage but that heavily is coming from umbrell nodes and things that people have thrown up easy because they were just embedded in the easy to use ones so the plebs have grown the l d usage throughout the network so and that is potentially a negative impact on Lightning as a whole because lightning Labs l d have such a hold enforcement I'm not saying that is a negative thing but but it it is perceived as that I guess at the minute and it probably is a little bit of a negative thing because you want it to be more evenly spread um so each one so is there interoperability between all these like this so there's how many lightning Protocols are there you say there's four those four main ones it's all separate protocols all separate implementations of the same rules that are called the bolts right so yes they are interoperable so it has been issues I can still send yeah it doesn't really matter who what yeah but this is the issue why it could become an issue is it's inherently different how Bitcoin core develops right in that these are all four five companies yeah and obviously they've kind of focused on there are little features that they want to build and maybe not spending as much resource into making sure the interoperable side is still working there's a lot of info diversions but one of the stronger we've seen a few bugs on some of them and then we've seen a few intraoperability issues that are on live mainnet where like you kind of look at Bitcoin and they kind of never make it that far it's um right it's an awkward one there's a lot of them fighting um that I think is probably gonna get worse but that's something where plebs won't necessarily understand them won't realize but they just throw up an umbrella node because they want to run lightning node and that is causing what you potentially are seeing now the outcome of that and we'll see over the next couple of years um so I think yeah there's definitely depending on the usage of the products using similar to uh Moon wallet the moon yeah that's everyone recommends it because it's a non-custodial um lighting wallet but the reality is it's not using it's it's hard it's not it's using lightning to make the payment but every single lightning payment is being counted with an on-chain Bitcoin payment from as far as my understanding which means it doesn't scale so if everybody uses Moon which everyone people keep a lot of clubs push people to go and use moons like their first wallet actually every transaction on there is technically a non-chained transaction even though it goes over the lightning Network how do they do that with the fee it's low fees increase the screwed on that as soon as there's a backlog on the network it's also screwed on that um so it's not well it's not so screwed on that the transactions will get through eventually but um they'll be creating a lot of backlog and adding to the backlog so it's not scalable and people are going and using that without really understanding how that's working on the The Wider impact I guess so there's certain things like that but again it's not sometimes necessarily up to the plebs to understand and learn that the company is putting that product out probably shouldn't be in some ways or should they are changing it on the wrong Moon meanwhile I think um as Zach said before yeah they're creating a new one yeah so using block streams green light I think so they should know they know that that's not scalable and they need to move to a correct better solution but they've tried to get some out as a market fit at the time to help people on board to lightning easier with a better ux um which theoretically it's potentially arguably done in some ways but with the trade-off of spamming the main on-chain Network um which doesn't scale and has lots of issues interesting so I think there's a lot of little things like that um what was the question again completely forgot it was what long-term effects basically like we're like that people are using if everyone started using Moon it would basically create backlogs on the network you can um but people are not realizing and they should start what could they be doing now basically to counteract these long-term impacts that you're not seeing there you know what what could a pleb be doing I mean there's no choices there for a player but it's just dependent on what moon would be the answer to that particularly important make sure your coins are off exchanges Cold Storage it's the usual isn't it well I think you could use Phoenix as a non-custodial instead of using Moon so you could do that you could also with umbrella and people running umbrella I think can you use uh score lightning now not yeah I think someone's hacked it but you can use like Citadel but there's other versions of umbrella that you can use that use other versions of things so it's again going and trying different ones rather than just the one so yeah there's just other options you gotta look into okay next question should we move on quickly because we're a bit long this one aren't we I just say there's a lot of questions so I should have read them uh I'll just do this very last one then quickly um we still gotta do merch of the month and the actual news and the actual news I think this ties in nicely at least we've covered Bitcoin a lot in this episode yeah that's a good one with Greg don't interrupt him no no it's all right I think this ties also nicely into uh Greg Frosty's for the kids Viewpoint um which he thought was the most powerful sentiment coming out of 2022. don't get down do we agree I'm not gonna lie I don't even know what Greg Frost is for the kids thing is for the kids what does it means I don't think I've ever listen to him speak once he's basically I have no disrespect a lot of buzzwords he says yeah he's he's very um inspirationally driven uh character I think is outspoken which is is good and gets people um hyped up but his big one was for the kids and he's like hashtag for the kids all the time so it's all thinking about Bitcoin but for the Next Generation okay this generation so the long term thinking of Bitcoin which does tie in yeah what we're talking about um I don't know if I thought we'd actively gone out and done something not just said no for the kids no it's just saying it okay this is going to pain that's a good Viewpoint to have you thought you might have actually gone out and built something or rather than just saying a little tagline yeah you know the the Foss thing the is it free open source yeah you weren't sure that was him that's hilarious he's tweeted at some point to do that and he had no idea I was like God Greg Foss really made it it speaks to long-term thinking of like yeah thinking about future Generations which is you know the long-term thinking of Bitcoin so it makes sense I agree yeah it's long time thinking I don't know it should be for the kids kids really for the kids kids the kids kids I'm not sure if it's going to be is the most important one of 2022 I think there's a lot of crazy stuff going on 2022 um but maybe it's a good way to help explain long term to people although you didn't get it when you we said for the kids did you at first three kids so I thought there might be some more to it there's not as a no it's just okay I think long term think next Generation keep it simple Dave how you want to leave the world to the Next Generation which yeah it's good my kids are my kids all up holding Bitcoin it's all good in my end I shouldn't say there's a lot of that inherently just in the world today you know climate change and all that jazz for the kids whatever she's called kind of came from a young Next Generation kid come in and trying to help climate change uh arguments she has got a point though remember when she's speaking in front of the EU I think he was and she's like how dare you oh how dare you think you're making making all these 67 year olds you know they're really uncomfortable yeah yeah Rich blokes which white blokes predominantly making decisions for her behalf so we need an angry six 15 16 year old kid to come and have a rant saying how dare you to the financial well or just to run at their parents and how do you save in fear how dare you I mean we could try that one to find someone willing to to run and be passionate about it my kids wouldn't do it [Laughter] of the month where you go oh is he bringing back the meat he's just got on a toilet break she can really you can really do the Q a now we can actually talk about what we want to talk get the actual questions that guy how's your dog Dave dog is absolutely the boy yeah yep I heard you took him out for a long walk he took him out for the walk might have been too long too long yeah but he was we were doing lots of um like um stay and oh yeah and like what obedience yeah a bit of obedience stuff but we are in the monks Hills so he's just absolutely pelling around his life was it windy as well because the wind goes in the valley so it's a really nice beautiful Bay do you have a dog whistle no I have a clucker oh no bounce towards me be jumping over streams and all stuff awesome yeah yeah he's a little loving it the dog is so cool it literally follows me your dog's not cool is it cool it comes everywhere with me now best mate jumps in the front seat sits on the seat s in the back yeah it's good well we're doing merchantments yeah I'm scared I'm gonna I'm gonna write match of the month we had Ruby Kate still no promo code or no still no no product unfortunately we just have to imagine yeah that'd be really good or some cows or something I was looking at a meat packs they look pretty good so it's pretty any of this bordering on pretty rude no I'm saying it seriously Molly meat pack I've I found it right I mean just yeah the terminology I always look at a meat packs doesn't anyway right yeah that was really good insightful Bitcoin chat there well that was really yeah that's all Merchant of the month I'm just laughing at the fact that we've only just started Sandra said I was looking at a meat pack and that sent me off so so much of the month red ruby cake have we got a website www dot review beautiful right I'm not do you want me to the Spiel again the 14 years she left Brighton to go and live in the wild Hills or we just want to get from the gym yeah yeah let's let's list products King coed meat box 55 quid which contains one top side joint a minimum is that what you're going to go for I was going to try that one first I think if we mean you both get that one and then we can just show you what we can show each other pictures of the meat we've cooked is this is 55 pounds sure you'll just get them though yeah and then then the shipping one is 15 courage them all together again together yeah get it delivered to your house yeah it's 15 per order so if you if you put it we can say right we've all cooked this steak or whatever and then we you can your chooses the best cooking steak it's got a picture of the stuff yeah yeah that's what we can do isn't it not to be sexist but I feel like it should be you three men because females can't cook steaks there's still three will do what about Mike Mikey cook as well spending 55 quid in the meatballs do you like do you cook steak yeah yeah very well oh there we go well we'll get a big box and we can take some out of it because yeah yeah probably won't because otherwise I'll have to oh she does a steak box we can get steak boxing did you just get a fillet steak for 18 quid just a steak I want to see the famous marbling because she has a certain breed of cows doesn't she she does she has the red root the ruby red Devon yeah that are famous for their delicious marbled meat okay so yeah well yeah I don't want to just a winner I don't know what that likes it's like salty yeah why don't they like him oh yeah to be fair oh yeah I didn't get the act in the first place what right millions of pounds so I got [ __ ] recently for saying that you can't just have steak by itself you've got to have like stuff to go with it do you give you that I think you can just eat it yeah you can yeah no I don't think you can I think you gotta have chips and bits to go with it oh just steak on a plate yeah yeah I mean yeah I'd either I mean I'd eat it but I definitely would never cook it you want some nice thick cut chips okay you want a little bit of like creamed spinach on the side okay yeah I mean that's it just sounds like a lovely meal and a nice day it's awesome peppercorn is nice yeah I had steak the other day I got [ __ ] for saying barbecue sauce as well yeah it's a bit of a Beach to the road I think I think it is your stake your rules yeah exactly exactly barbecue sauce is nice that's fine yeah thank you it was in the Maxi chat to be fair like ethereum all over it should we speed up and get them with the news or I mean do you want to do the news because it was not that much so yeah we became dot Co dot UK it's conscious of how long what time we are making one hour Wow Let's Get on the news I'm just predominantly you right less than 100 Bitcoin ATMs added worldwide in the second half of 2022. what do you got to say about that questionable no I don't know the usage of Bitcoin ATMs I'd be interested to to know how many people are using Bitcoin where did we get that stat from unfortunately I can't click the link yeah so that is a downside of paper yeah okay moving on uh I'm with Zach I I'd need to see the whole stats of usage before and what are people using Bitcoin ATMs for wasn't a load of Bitcoin ATMs recalled because they couldn't something to do with laws and I don't know I don't know last year something that came out in the UK which was a bucket yeah two or three years ago okay right uh Mountain clock's repayment registration deadline moved to March 2023. what was it prior because that's pretty soon yeah I think it was like the November or December I don't know when but yeah it was it been brought forward or postponed no it's pretty templates there's still loads of things I think for it to iron out and go through I think that could be an admin nightmare forever yeah 10 years how many years on it's just ridiculous here time it takes that's the same with the FTX stuff this is going to be years in the making this is not happening overnight so there's any of him paid hours it's just basically there's a big lump of people gonna get a Bitcoin payout soon there's yeah so they're all gonna get I think even though when that goes ahead there's still I I think the realistic estimation was like early 2024 the earliest before people actually get some Bitcoin back and stuff are they getting Bitcoin value or Fiat value uh they're getting Bitcoin but in Fiat value equivalent I think so like if they rode 10 grand from it they'll get 10 runs with Bitcoin at today's value they won't get the Bitcoin they had in Mount Cox back in the day because it's all gone but fortunately because the Bitcoin price has gone up so much they can theoretically cover the Fiat value now of these this is why they keep postponing it until the prices are price was the price locked in already I don't know don't know enough about that I keep postponing it until the prices I know a lot of people have sold their shares already yeah right I passed my claim onto someone else and sell it for which is great yeah yeah yeah I remember yeah when people were going around buying claims yeah do you think so are you do you anticipate of the market be slightly flooded at that point with I don't know I think there's a bit make some mix and match because it doesn't all come at once as well I think it'll get put in all the time so again there's no need to panic in that respect but I think also these people are potentially been holding for that many years if they were that desperate to dump at any point that have probably already sold their shares to somebody else don't get me wrong then people could still whoever that company or entity is could still dump whatever they've got a hold of um but I think a lot of people if they're still if they were back in the mountain Cox days and they've had Bitcoin from then they've probably already got lots of the Bitcoin on the way so they'll know and be you know they've gone through three bull markets now um they're gonna hold off to the next bull market I would imagine um at least if not longer so yeah I'm not too worried about a dump that I think [Music] with 20 left I don't know what just the way they say it wrong um um I think we all yeah there was big rumors around the whole company going pop wasn't I think because of the all their telegram chats and stuff got shut down I think but um yeah 20 layoffs seems to be the standard McDonald's that's a lot for McDonald's yeah no so the middle Management areas yeah but people always see like oh we could always revert back to McDonald's if things go wrong in Bitcoin yeah I'm setting my sights a bit higher um that's not corporate the corporate level's the even franchise that's the franchise the corporate level that's what they'll be getting rid of they'll be the franchise between big Logistics franchise didn't make sense right 91 of cryptos from 2014 have died while Bitcoin continues to thrive that's good where did it start come from I saw this as well it was a company that did a nice infographic with it enjoy a nice infographic I've not seen that yet that's good though you can borrow it and put it on here now ping so um no I mean that's good it just these are the sort of starts that we need to push out there more and more so to show people that you know why Bitcoin and why not all these other random XYZ coins that they're going by yeah um and because every cycle we've seen we've got experience every cycle let these things come around and die and from 2014 that's two ball Cycles so it's took it's prefer it's got two ball Cycles two bear cycles for um 91 to be wiped out but it's still a lot and most and they were probably more credible ones back then you get these days because these days it's so easy to just create any old yeah that would have been like pre-ico yeah and all that stuff that was like you you like calling the Dogecoin era and they're the ones that are left standing but there was I was there was touching on some of the video once I found my old wallets for some mega coin World coins uh but these are all the wallets 2013 time I think I'm just digging out the other day um remember was it Bitcoin God they were air dropping on Christmas Day for everyone wow that's a lovely thing to do yeah yeah um but there was loads of them back then that they're probably slightly more credible in certain ways than what you've got quite well it sounds incredibly like ship no yeah do you think the the life cycle of a crypto is much less than the 30.7 yeah seven or eight years okay uh Bank of France Governor calls for mandatory licensing for crypto companies don't know much about that no I missed it who's that sorry Bank of France Governor Bank of France governor uh only one for compliance I mean yeah he I mean yeah I mean everyone's calling for cryptocurrency regulation but they don't know what that means they're just calling for it because it's it's the Hot Topic to say to ensure they get the clout and the exposure that they need in a positive manner I think they're just all chasing you can say what they want so back to this Woods Too Many Words no meaning sick of words oh my God you use enough for them last one Thai SEC launches crypto Academy to help digital asset investors terrible idea oh terrible idea why I just said that's nice investors that's the program oh sorry a crypto Academy yeah yeah so you're going to end up how to advise and how to advise invest in in cryptocurrencies which you can't don't the devices don't yeah yeah yeah maybe that's all right yeah 91 are all failing on to zero we're now doing this course to let people know how to invest in that we should put a comparison up of the amount of public Stock Exchange companies that have failed since 2014 versus cryptocurrencies 2014. and then put them next so you'll see what's because that's what people are either investing in the stock market that's the point yeah don't invest in cryptocurrencies okay invest don't invest in Bitcoin buy Bitcoin stack Bitcoin spend because you're sure don't don't invest in okay because he thinks he was speaking to get on a YouTube show then [Laughter] but not investment advice no sounded like investment advice so Danny yeah it wasn't and that's the key yeah I added the disclaimer is it investment advice if you tell someone not to invest but then they've not done anything because you've revised them so the money they could have again yeah that's a tactic to you isn't it right there we go that's it we're done great great part is there no more beautiful I want to do any more that's cool no these chairs aren't that good I keep sliding down I'm like that do you you get like that a little bit it seems particularly slidy anyway you know we're not even real Bitcoin is because we shouldn't have chess peace [Music]